By Jeff Elbel photo by Frank Ockenfels

fter many years of touring with a bevy of classic pop hits from their ‘ 80s heyday , including “ Change ,” “ Pale Shelter ,” “ Shout ,” and “ Sowing the Seeds of Love ,” British band Tears for Fears have returned to the road with a powerful new album . With The Tipping Point , co-leaders Roland Orzabal and Curt Smith revisit the heady territory that produced landmark albums The Hurting and Songs from the Big Chair . The pair trades reflections on troubled childhood for true tales of adult trauma and the perspective of maturity . The Tipping Point also includes blasts of joy that recall the tone of evergreen single “ Everybody Wants to Rule the World .” Orzabal spoke with IE ’ s Jeff Elbel by phone before Tears for Fears ’ performance last month at Hollywood Casino Amphitheatre in Tinley Park .

IE : People in 2022 seem to be responding to The Tipping Point in a way that didn ' t happen for your reunion effort Everybody Loves a Happy Ending in 2004 . Is that your perception ? RO : Yeah , totally . It ’ s a different world now than when we put out Happy Ending in so many ways – the crisis after crisis that seems to be happening at the moment , echoing the crisis in my life recently . I think that we ’ re just tapping into the zeitgeist more than when we were doing Happy Ending , which was kind of insular . We were making the record in a bubble of L . A . This album is entirely different . We ' re really plumbing the depths . The material consequently is far deeper , richer , and more emotive than Happy Ending . I mean , I love

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Happy Ending . It ’ s got some great songs on it , but The Tipping Point is up there with our best work .

IE : I had an impression that Everybody Loves a Happy Ending might have been meant to mark reconciliation between you and Curt and maybe to serve as closure for the band on a high note . Is that a false impression ? Because here we are 18 years later to talk about new music . RO : No , you ' re absolutely right . I think that the whole point of that project was getting back together , sort of burying the hatchet . For me , it was an amazing change of lifestyle . My kids were still young enough for me to take them out of school and switch them to a school in L . A . That change was wonderful and really much needed . I also bought a house in L . A ., which was nice , around the corner from Curt . So , from a personal point of view , it was an incredibly successful period , but the album just didn ' t do much at all . And I think there ' s probably two reasons for that . When L . A . Reid got dropped from Arista Records , so did we . So , we were then in freefall searching for a record company to put out the record when maybe we should have just waited .

IE : As The Tipping Point was arriving , I heard about comparisons to The Hurting . It seemed to me that the comparison might be valid more in terms of themes rather than sound . If I name your big singles that everybody knows , I think of “ Break it Down Again ,” which is defiant and determined . I

think of “ The Seeds of Love ,” which is uplifting and positive . As beautiful as it is , “ The Tipping Point ” is haunting and seems to be about the dividing line between living and dying . That tone might compare to The Hurting . Am I on the right track ? RO : The way I see it is with The Hurting , we were writing about the traumas of your childhood – the whole [ groundbreaking psychotherapist ] Arthur Janov primal therapy thing . Obviously , we ’ re a lot older now . Your childhood can be traumatic , but unfortunately , life itself is traumatic . It doesn ' t really matter what age you are . Bad things can happen at any point . I think that The Tipping Point is really addressing adult trauma with grief and loss .

IE : I wondered how difficult it must be to perform a song like “ The Tipping Point ,” coming from such a traumatic personal experience with [ wife ] Caroline [ who passed in 2017 following a difficult illness ]. I also wondered what it ’ s like to write something as personal as the related “ Please Be Happy ” and give it to your partner to sing . That seems like it would require an enormous amount of trust . RO : I have this theory in terms of something like Curt singing “ Please Be Happy .” I have a voice that sort of grabs hold of the narrative and is quite forceful . The beauty of Curt ' s voice is that it allows the story to be told without beating anyone over the head . There ' s no lecturing , you know ?

IE : I have a fan ’ s perspective on that idea . I

think of you as a singer ’ s singer and a great baritone . I think of Curt ' s pure tenor as inviting and relatable . I ’ m swept away by the sound of your voice , and I identify with Curt ' s voice . Those two different experiences provide depth to your band ’ s sound . RO : That ’ s a very good way of putting it . I do think that people find his voice so human and relatable , as you say , that it ' s a real asset . We are very lucky on this album that The Tipping Point has so many songs that Curt sings . It ' s great for me at shows ; I can take some time off [ laughs ]. It ' s worked really well .

IE : Do you ever struggle to find your way into each other ' s songs ? Or is it second nature because of how different your voices are and your experience together ? RO : No , I think it ' s quite simple . If a song is brilliant , then it ' s pretty obvious . It has to have an inherent truth and inherent quality , and then we ' re both fine with it .

IE : The other part of the earlier question would have been about performing difficult material like the title song “ The Tipping Point ” or “ Please Be Happy .” RO : I don ' t struggle with “ The Tipping Point ” whatsoever because it ' s really about being in a situation where you have no control . So , when you ' re watching this person flicker like a candle between life and death , you don ' t have any control . At that point in time , it ' s the beginning of the phase of denial because there ' s nothing you can do . You let them go . You don ' t know where they ' re going . Singing

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